In this episode, Jason interviews Matt Calvert, a former NHL player for the Columbus Blue Jackets and Colorado Avalanche, now a player agent. They discuss Matt's unconventional path to professional hockey, from a young boy with aspirations of becoming an accountant to an NHL player. The conversation explores player development, parental involvement, the role of self-direction, and the importance of mindset in achieving success in hockey. Matt contrasts his experiences with teammates like Colin Wilson, who had a generational NHL background, and shares insights on how he approaches coaching his own children. They also delve into the evolving landscape of player development and Matt's current work in athlete management, aiming to provide valuable lessons for parents and young athletes.
Matt Calvert: From Aspiring Accountant to NHL Veteran
In this episode of 'The Next Next,' host Jason welcomes former NHL player and current player agent Matt Calvert. They delve into Matt's journey from a small town in Brandon, Manitoba, to becoming a professional hockey player with the Columbus Blue Jackets and Colorado Avalanche. The episode explores the contrasts in upbringing and development paths between Matt and his friend and former NHL teammate Colin Wilson. Matt shares his insights on youth player development, the importance of mindset, and how he balances structure with fun in coaching his own sons. They also discuss the role of player agents in today's hockey world and the value of small-scale, personalized player development.
00:00 Introduction to Matt Calvert
00:42 Matt's Early Life and Hockey Beginnings
03:34 The Journey to Professional Hockey
06:53 Draft Day and Early Professional Career
10:32 Making it to the NHL
26:22 Balancing Structure and Freedom in Training
40:01 Engaging Kids in Hockey Training
40:47 The Role of Fun and Competition
41:39 Coaching Styles and Learning from Others
43:16 Balancing Parental Expectations and Child's Enjoyment
44:09 Reading Your Child's Needs
48:14 Different Paths to Success in Hockey
52:31 Parental Involvement in Child's Development
57:13 Team Concepts vs. Individual Skills
01:02:18 Mindset and Handling Adversity
01:08:40 The Role of Agents and Advisors
01:17:09 Final Thoughts and Advice for Parents
Jason Jacobs: Today on the next next, our guest is Matt Calvert. Matt is a Canadian former professional ice hockey left winger who played for the Columbus Blue Jackets and Colorado Avalanche in the NHL. He's currently a player agent, actually. And I got to Matt through Colin Wilson, who came on the show just before Matt.
And they were teammates in the NHL and I was excited because they have very different upbringings. Colin, of course, is a third generation, NHL, or his dad played in the NHL. His grandfather played in the NHL when Colin was nine. He said he knew that he was gonna be in the NHL, or at least he believed it at the time, whereas Matt was on a different path.
His parents weren't very athletic, and when he was 18, he still thought he was gonna be an accountant when he grew up. Yet he ended up making it to the show and having a great career. It. So we have a great discussion about Matt's journey in the sport when he started to believe that he had a [00:01:00] shot, how self-directed he was, what role his parents had in his development process.
We also talk about the state of the game today and, and how it's different for new players coming up, and that's especially relevant. In this one because Matt has a couple of, sons who play hockey at a 2016 and a 2018 little guy. And, and Matt is pretty involved in coaching them as well. So, it's fascinating just talking about Matt's path, what he would've done different, how it's different for players coming up, and also what he's gonna do with his boys relative to what his parents did with him.
At any rate, I really enjoyed this one, and I hope you do as well. Matt, welcome to the show.
Matt Calvert: Thanks for having me, Jason. Great to be here.
Jason Jacobs: Thanks for coming. I have to tell you, I'm psyched about this one and not for the reasons that you think you, you probably think I'm excited because, you know, you are an exceptional hockey player who had a fantastic career in the NHL. That is exciting, don't get me wrong. But what's also exciting is that [00:02:00] I'm trying to get to the root of player development and what drives it and looking at things like nature versus nurture and mental versus physical and understanding people's journeys.
And I got you through your buddy Colin Wilson and who I still don't feel comfortable calling Willie, even though it seems like that's what everyone calls him. But he knew he was gonna be in the NHL when he was nine. He just knew, right? His dad played in the NHL, his grandfather played in the NHL, like he was gonna be in the NHL.
He was a giant, like he, you know, right. You were a little guy. Your parents weren't that athletic. You when you were 18 dreamed of being an accountant, yet you ended up having this great career, right? And so the contrast of that is staggering and I'm just so excited to learn more about your story 'cause I think there's gonna be some insights there that'll be helpful for, me and other parents out there.
And also helpful for this platform that we're trying to build. But, but, but first trying to really build a worldview that is solid so that whatever we build is gonna actually be helpful and not be part of the problem. So [00:03:00] there you go. Too long an intro, but psyched to have you.
Matt Calvert: Great to be here. Yeah, it's uh, it's kind of a fascinating comparison. Me and Willie, because he was in Winnipeg and I'm in Brandon, which is two hours apart. So that's our biggest rival. And like you said, he was a generational NHL and he was really good from, from nine years old on. And then I was just playing for fun and, uh, and we both ended up on the same team and sitting beside each other in the Colorado Avalanche locker room.
So, um, just two completely different paths to get there. And, uh, yeah, pretty cool.
Jason Jacobs: Well, let's hear the path. We don't need to go through every, uh, every nook and cranny. But, but what's the CliffNotes version of, of your story? Like how, I mean, given that your parents weren't that athletic, how did you find the game? And, with the benefit of hindsight what are some of the key takeaways from your journey?
Matt Calvert: Yeah, so I grew up, uh, two older brothers. Like I said, grew up in Brandon, Manitoba and it is cold. It is winter for six months, uh, of the year. So [00:04:00] backyard rink was always a thing. Community hockey rinks outside. Both my brothers played hockey, uh, more for fun. They ended up quitting when they were 13 or 14 years old, and I fell in love with it early on.
Jason Jacobs: Where, where were you in the pecking order, age-wise?
Matt Calvert: I was the youngest brother, so I, uh, I always got beat up and I, I had to learn how to be tough I guess. But, uh, no, it was, uh, I, I played hockey for fun. Like I said, my parents enrolled me in minor hockey. We didn't have as many options for spring or summer. They, they were out there. It's not something we did.
I ran track, I played baseball, uh, I played soccer. I, I did every other sport. And once minor hockey ended in February, March, depending on the age group, I would move on to something else. And I would go a whole summer, maybe one hockey camp throughout the summer, that's three or four days long. And then enroll again and start up again in October.
Um, I was a very small kid. And Willie said, like he had NHL in his mind at nine years [00:05:00] old. I currently have two boys, seven and nine, and obviously
Jason Jacobs: by the way, that's another big difference, right? Is that, you are a crazy hockey dad. He is not, although he might end up being one with his daughter, but we'll see. I was, I was teasing him about that, but yeah.
Matt Calvert: Yeah, no, we, we talk a lot and I'm like, I'm like, Hey, if you're a generational NHL, you gotta get her into sports. She's gonna be athletic, right? Genetically gifted. But anyways, I have two boys, seven and nine. And uh, we talk about the NHL all the time. They're curious. They were in the dressing room growing up and, you know, they were a little bit younger.
They have some memories, but this wasn't a conversation. My household growing up, you know, my dad, uh, worked for a cable company and, uh, my mom was a janitor, a brand university locally. So it's, it was always just any sport you do, kid, you work hard, you have fun and, and enjoy it. You know that, that's why you're in sport, to make friends and, and learn some discipline, structure, battle, some adversities, that type of thing.
So anyways, I was always one of the stronger players in my age group. But never really, you know, my [00:06:00] parents never said yes to those extra development gaps and the, you know, the skill training or the cool tournaments, which was fine by me. Tell you the truth, I probably didn't even know about three quarters of them.
Um, I was just off being a kid, playing road hockey or doing whatever, backyard baseball in the summers. And and then all of a sudden things got a little more serious. You get to the WHL Bantam draft and, uh, when you're 15, 14, 15 years old. And I remember seeing, uh, a ranking it, it was some hockey scouting website.
It was called. They would do rankings for the Western Hockey League, for example. And there was a top 300 in my draft year. And just keep in mind, Colin Wilson was probably first or second in the Manitoba League scoring. I was fourth and I was four foot 11. And Willie would've been five nine at the time.
Um, something like that. A bigger kid. I. I was not in the top 300 rankings for the Western Hockey League draft. So not even a thought of getting drafted. Draft day went by, didn't get a sniff. And then, uh, and then the next year, uh, was our first year U 18 [00:07:00] camp. I was able to go to Brown Wheat Kings Western Hockey League camp, which is my local WHL team.
Went there, sent home right after rookie camp, and then ended up making the U 18 team as a 15-year-old. I, uh, I went to height and weights and I was five foot one, 100 pounds. Playing against, you know, young men didn't have the best year. I scored one goal all year and physically I just wasn't there.
Um, they picked me anyways. I was decently fast and a smart hockey player, but really struggled that first year. So. The next year. I didn't even have an invite as a 16-year-old to a Western Hockey league camp. My thought process then switched to, okay. And my, my end goal in all this, um, you know, as a kid was, how do I get schooling outta this?
Because I knew I was gonna have to pay for university, which is something I wanted to do. Like you mentioned before, I had a dream of maybe becoming an accountant and, uh, I love numbers. I had a few friends dads that were accountants and I thought they looked pretty successful and it looked like something that's, uh, that interested [00:08:00] me.
So anyways, I, I went back to my 16-year-old year and, uh, ended up leading the team in scoring and it's just the local U 18 team. But definitely gained some confidence. I
Jason Jacobs: wait. You led the team in scoring after that same team the year prior, barely having a goal.
Matt Calvert: I did, and, uh, I.
Jason Jacobs: changed? So did, did anything, was it just time or did you actually do anything different in between the, in between those years,
Matt Calvert: Four inches and 25 pounds. So we got up to about five foot five at this point and one 30. And, uh, that, that was a big part of it. I was just so small. There were small kids
Jason Jacobs: was that just father time or, or were you, you know, did you hit the gym different than you had in years prior?
Matt Calvert: I would say time. And then as far as off ice training, my mom was a huge influence on me. It wasn't necessarily pushed towards hockey. It, she loved to run, she loved to work out. So I was that kid and I, I was, uh, I don't wanna call myself a track star, but I was successful in, in track and field. And, um, she would push me [00:09:00] in that type of training, running, sprinting, and all that.
So I would often do training with her and. It was never directed specifically at hockey, but in turn it helped. And I was fast twitch, so that helped me on the ice. And once I grew, got a little bit stronger, you know, I started to become faster than most. So after my 16-year-old year, I, uh, I got invited back to the Western Hockey League, uh, brand new weekend camp.
And I went to camp and I, I'm a 1989 born and often in hockey we talk about, not age, but years born. And I went to camp at 17 and was probably the best, 1989, born at camp. Meanwhile they had four of these guys signed all guys I played growing up. That in my mind, I knew I was better then and not, uh, not to be cocky, but I, I did, I just was very small.
So I went to camp, had an awesome camp, end up going through the middle, veteran DE caught me with a hit, broke my left wrist. They kind of told me, you know, wow, we, like you, really surprised us. We had other plans possibly keeping you, um, [00:10:00] but go back to your U 18 team. And we'll see what happens throughout the year.
So I believe I missed 10 games, came back, almost led the league in scoring after missing a quarter, quarter of the season. And, uh, I had a ton of options after that. I could have,
Jason Jacobs: wait, when you, when you didn't have a wrist were, were you were you just sitting around driving yourself crazy or, or were you training.
Matt Calvert: I was training in any way I could. The, the message I always give to teammates or clients as I I run a agency now is, Hey, if. If you hurt your ankle, you hurt your wrist, whatever, it's, try to get better in something else. Whether that's your mental game, that's your, you're on the bike conditioning, what, whatever you can do, try to get better.
And, uh, that's something I did. But then when I came back, I came back early as I did my whole career. I always, I always pushed it. I couldn't really shoot the puck that well. Uh, I was still finding ways to score goals, but I had to start passing the puck a
Jason Jacobs: This was your
Matt Calvert: This was my bottom hand yet. So I had to start [00:11:00] seeing the ice a little more.
So I gotta add to my game in that sense. And it's just an another way of getting better until my wrist strength, uh, you know, improved. Anyways, we end up winning the league having a great year. And then I had all, all kinds of options. I had a couple scholarship offers in Manitoba. It wasn't heavily scouted by the ncaa.
I actually have a cool story. Uh, Eddie Belfor. Uh, legendary goalie. He owned the Winkler Flyers. That's who I was with in the Manitoba Junior Hockey League. So we have WHL level, then junior, a level in Canada. And if you wanted to go NCAA a o to Canada, generally you go to one of the junior A leagues spread across Canada and then you get a scholarship from there.
Well, Eddie flew into Brandon and took myself and one of my teammates, uh, out for dinner to the fanciest restaurant we got. And, uh, and he, he offered me a sum of money, which I don't think is legal. And I. Guaranteed me a scholarship to, uh, university of North Dakota. And, Eddie can't guarantee scholarships, but this is, this is what was happening.
And so I had, I [00:12:00] was, you know, I was a kid with $500 in my bank account at the most. I had a, a summer job and, you know, it was enticing. I also had options to go BC Junior, Alberta Junior or Saskatchewan Junior. So, I got a phone call from, uh, Kelly MCC Crimmon, who is the, uh, GM of the Vegas Golden Knights right now.
And, uh, he actually, I grew up in the same neighborhood as him 'cause he owned the Brandon Wheat Kings forever. He was owner, president, GM coach, you name it. He had every role. He brought me in and, uh, he said, I, I want you to play for us next year. And. Generally 18-year-old rookie isn't a normal thing in the WHL.
It's kind of late to start your career. And I just said the only way I'll come is if I get four years of schooling. Thought I was negotiating like crazy by myself. My parents forced me to go by myself as well, um, as they didn't really know much about the process and, uh, he said done right away. So I was a Brandon weak king.
I went in my 18-year-old year, uh, and it was turned out to be my NHL draft year. I remember the first month you [00:13:00] get, uh, you get stuff from the NHL, you gotta, if you're draft eligible, you gotta fill out your name, interest, height and weight, all that kind of stuff. By this point I was 5 9 1 60 and uh, and I was like, ah, this is, this is cool, but, you know, probably something not on my radar.
I ended up getting put on an all rookie line with a guy named Braden Chen and, uh, Scott Glenny. They were both 16. I was 18 years old, so I was the veteran rookie on the line. Um, we hit the ground running. We literally never separated the rest of our junior career. For those of you who don't know, Brad, she's the captain of the St.
Louis Blues right now. Um, Scott Glenny, uh, never went on to play pro, but he was a eighth overall pick in the NHL. Um, anyways, my draft year, 18-year-old year, I just, it was fun. It was a bunch of kids playing hockey, playing against older guys, three rookies and we were dominant. I was, I was almost a point of game.
I think Chen ended up leading our team in scoring, um, which is just [00:14:00] unheard of for first year guys in this league, especially when you're playing 18 to 20-year-old men. And then all of a sudden I was on the draft radar. I, uh, there was central scouting rankings came out, uh, the preliminary rankings and I was like on a top 15 players to watch.
And I remember calling my parents 'cause I was on the road in Saskatoon and being like, man, like I just got put on A NHL. Ranked list and, and like, they're like, what is this? Like, we had no idea, right? And then it's, we're like, wow, this is pretty cool. So I just, I kept plugging along and I'm like, I gotta do everything to get drafted.
So midterm rankings came out, Kelly McMan brought me in his office. He's like, Maddie, what do you think you're ranked? And I'm like, I don't know. You know, I got cut from a lot of teams growing up. 'cause my size always down. I'm like, I don't know. Am I still ranked crim? And, and he would say, you're, you're 60 at midterm.
He brings me in for the final, final rankings release. Once again, I had no idea, we weren't too much into social media at this time either. So, all these kids have it on their phones now. And he goes, what do you think you're ranked? And I, I believe it was somewhere in the forties, [00:15:00] um, that I ended up and I was in complete shock.
'cause like I told you about the Western Hockey League list couldn't even crack the top 300, in the western part of Canada, and now I'm on an NHL list. So, um, he was in shock. I was in shock. And he's like, man, you, you've earned it. But he's like, I did not see this coming a year ago. This is how much you've developed in one year.
Um, anyways, I have an agent knock on my door in April. He comes in and he goes, we'd love to represent you.
Jason Jacobs: Was it literally a door knock?
Matt Calvert: it. It was, uh, it was a, a meet at the, uh, meet at the,
Jason Jacobs: okay. Yeah. 'cause I was gonna say like door knocks actually were, you know, I'm, I was born in the seventies and like door knocks actually used to happen. I feel like now if you door knock, like someone's gonna come out with a shotgun.
Matt Calvert: Yeah, you're very, yeah, you don't really wanna talk to him. And then he comes over to our house. I guess that was the reference, the door knock. He came over after one meeting and, uh, we had a lot of questions we're like, okay, like NHL draft, what do we expect? What is this explain to us. So he did, he brought us up to speed.
We elected not to go to the [00:16:00] draft. I was just like, i've been cut too many times. I don't want that disappointment if I go. So I stayed home with my family. They told me second, third, possibly fourth round, I would go, um, there's articles of you in the paper, there's expectations. And I'm like, man, like if I don't go, this is embarrassing.
Anyways, one, two round, three round four goes by and I'm just like, I'm sweating. I go in the backyard, shoot some hoops for a bit. I come back in and all of a sudden I see on the draft board my name gets slid up behind when I was watching live, uh, to columbus hundred 27th overall. So I was in, I literally thought, uh, this is the best thing ever. I couldn't, couldn't believe it, to tell you the truth. It just happened so fast. And I was very naive at the time. You know, a lot of people that get drafted in fifth, sixth, seventh round, you know, there's, there's so many people out there. Oh yeah. He's gonna be in tough to make the NHL.
He's, he's small. He is undersized. They're taking a chance on whatever comment you make. I, I was like, I'm making NHL now. That's all, that's all I thought. And, [00:17:00] and my first thought was, okay, there's a draft class. There was, I don't know what, there was seven or eight in my draft class drafted. I said, now I gotta be better.
I'm at summer camp. I gotta be the best player on the ice. And that's all I ever thought. I never had any distraction. Someone telling me I wasn't good enough or whatever. Parents were the same. We were just naive. Um, so I go to summer development camp one of the better players on the ice, put 'em on notice, right?
Because a lot of times when kids get drafted, I. A scout brings a kid from Brandon that he really likes, like myself or someone brings one from Europe and, and they try to convince their, their management to the guys that, or the decision makers to draft the kid. So anyways, I make a name for myself. We go to fall camp.
There was a rookie tournament in Traverse City, Michigan, which was always a really fun time. I went, I went three years and ended up being one of the better players on the Columbus Blue Jackets prospects team. So ended up getting an NHL exhibition game. Within that year, I go back to junior hockey for my 19-year-old season.
November rolls around, I get invited to Canadian [00:18:00] World Junior Camp, and uh, for a Canadian to get invited to World Junior Camp was probably bigger than. Getting drafted in the NHL as a kid, every boxing day on the December 26th, the world junior starts, and it was like tradition to watch it. And uh, to me that was the coolest thing ever.
I ended up getting injured right before camp I I attended. I wasn't able to skate. So very, very disappointing. Probably one of the worst moments of my hockey career. They ended up winning the, the gold medal that year, which was very cool. Anyways, I'm 20 years old. I go to Columbus Blue Jackets camp and I had I had grown two inches since I was drafted at 18.
This is how late of a bloomer I was. So I was five 11 now and started to put on some weights, started to become a man and I had a phenomenal camp. I think I ended up being a point game guy in exhibition in Columbus. Ken Hitchcock was the coach at the time and the whole camp. They're talking about me signing, me signing.
They want me to go to Syracuse, which was the farm team at the time. Hitchcock brings me in and, [00:19:00] and I end up telling him, you know what? I'm going back to Brandon for my 20-year-old year. I just thought being such a late bloomer, starting at 18, I could use another year of confidence, be the man in the league, that type of thing.
And on the flip side, we were hosting the moral cup. So we had a auto ticket into the Moral Cup, which is the, the, uh, CHL championship in Canada. Anyways, Ken Hitchcock brings me in and he had coached in the Western League many years before, and he goes, Matt, if you're in Prince Albert Saskatchewan, which is very far up north, and it's minus 45 Celsius, and you want the hell outta there.
You call me and, and we'll get you to pro hockey. And I said, I said hitch, like I'm good. I, I am gonna go back. I'm gonna try to win a championship. I got a great team, a bunch of great line mates and, and at the time and we're talking development. I thought that was the best for my development. Keep in mind, I was turning down $200,000 signing bonus and a three year NHL contract, which my dad thought I was a complete psychopath for doing because like, like I said, we didn't have a lot.
And he's like, how do you [00:20:00] turn this down Maddy? And I go. I go, I don't know. I just, I think this is the best path for me and, uh, I said, Hey, maybe I go back and I make more. Right? And that was never the plan. But, uh, anyways, I go back for my 20-year-old season. We don't end up winning the MEM cup. We, we lose heavily in the finals actually.
But an awesome year nonetheless. And end up signing a pro contract at the end of that year, ended up getting a much larger signing bonus. So it worked out financially for me, but as far as the development path it just gave me a chance just like my third year in U 18 that I stayed back, that most guys don't.
It gave me a chance to be the man at a certain level and, and gain that extra confidence. I go into my first year pro they had changed a HL teams by this point. We were the Springfield Falcons in Massachusetts. So I moved out to Springfield. I lived at home my whole life in small farm town in, you know, Manitoba.
And now I'm on the, now I'm in Massachusetts. And, uh, and I have to learn how to drive on a freeway. I have to learn how to live in a big, you know, a bigger city. And, [00:21:00] and it's just, everything's
Jason Jacobs: we, we, we also have some of the 'cause I'm in Massachusetts, we have some of the worst drivers on the planet.
Matt Calvert: I've been told that when I got there, they told me they, they, they call 'em mass holes and, uh, and it was, it was crazy, like for, for a guy that has a, you know, a few streets in his city and, and, and highways not freeways. It was, it was a lot. And, uh, so it took me a little while.
Jason Jacobs: Rush hour driving is like playing in an NHL game.
Matt Calvert: It, it's nuts. So it took me a while to get used to those things, but on ice it was always hockey and it was always fun. So come January that first year Pro the coach brought me over wanted to talk to me in pregame. Skate. Said You're going to the, he actually said you're going to the big leagues kid.
He was a great guy. And I just, I was in complete shock. I ended up hopping on a plane all the way from Springfield to, uh, to Anaheim to play my first game. This was early January of my first year pro. So I went within a three to four year span. I went from being a third year guy in U 18 to playing in the NHL.
And [00:22:00] I always go back to this one comment, uh, when I played that, that third year of U 18 as a 17-year-old, which was my grade 12 year my buddies who are great and I don't fault them for it, but we're sitting there in English class the one day and. Um, you know, we're talking about, I, I think we had like a hockey news out and I would always scour the prospect lists on teams and look for a small guy.
And I was like, well, this guy made it. I'm like, why can't I, this guy made it. And a couple of my buddies go, uh, something about like, you know, you think you're gonna make the NHL. And I was like, absolutely. I'm like, why not? I'm like, I'll, you know, I'll go to junior a I'll go to college, and this was before the Western League.
I'll just grind my way there. And, uh, and they like, literally start laughing. I remember going to the foyer where all their lockers were, and one of my buddies told the whole team that, Hey, Maddie thinks he's going to the NHL. And I was literally like, I was laughed at and like, that stuff didn't phase me.
I, I literally was like, huh, we'll see boys. So a year later I was drafting the NHL. And those same guys who are great friends of mine came up and they're [00:23:00] like, what happened? And they're like, they're like, holy smokes, man. And I'm just like, yeah. I'm like, I, I told you, I, you can't give up on it. And then three years after that, or two years after that, I'm playing NHL games.
You know, and then game 20 in my career, I, I get a hat trick and, and just like little, little things like that. And my, I think everyone around me and that I grew up with was in more shock than, than myself. Because I was just a, a small guy, decent hockey player throughout my whole minor hockey career.
You know, and, and I, we, on the development side of things, we take things so seriously. If your kid's the best at 10 years old, like he's going to the NHL, but the amount of times things change, um, and someone made a comment to me the other day. A lot of people are probably familiar with that brick hockey tournament that happens in Edmonton and in July, it's supposed to be one of the best tournaments in North America.
All the best 10 year olds go to it. All that is is it's
Jason Jacobs: All the non hockey people just did a double take when you said that, because they're like, [00:24:00] what do you mean the best 10 year olds? Like, aren't 10 year olds still wearing diapers and, and binkies in their mouth?
Matt Calvert: well for out, for an outsider that's not in the hockey world, that's like, it, it sounds insane, trust me. It sounded insane to me when I came back. But once you're in it, it's intense. But what this is, is it's not the kids that are gonna be the best hockey players in the end, it's the kids that are the most developed by 10 years old.
And does that mean they started at three and got a headstart? Does that mean they're physically bigger and stronger than everyone? Does that mean they just, they get things faster than most kids, like mentally like it, it's, there's so many different angles, and I'm kind of a nerd of development. I love to like study the why, whether it's a 7-year-old kid, a 4-year-old kid, a 10-year-old, or a NHL player.
Like, I'm just like, why is that player good? And I often have these conversations with a few of my friends. One's a a very talented skill coach, and I'm just like, I'm like, Kate, this kid is so skilled. He does these drills so well, but like, why is he good? What, what, what [00:25:00] makes him successful out there?
Anyways, to wrap up my story, I went on, went on to play, um, 11 year
Jason Jacobs: Wait, no. To wrap up your story, you were talking about the brick tournament and I cut you off.
Matt Calvert: oh, well, I, I kind of went to the, the brick tournament there just talking about how like you don't have to be. The best. At seven. At 10. At 12, at 14, which was not me. You know, Colin Wilson played in the brick, I believe, and, and it's like he had a team of all Manitoba kids. Well, I lived in Manitoba and I wasn't on that team, but in the end, you know, me and Colin were the, the two guys that, that made it out of our age group.
So it's not a race. But to wrap up, I guess that part, I ended up playing 11 years in the NL with Columbus Blue Jackets and Colorado avalanche and and grinded every single year to stay there. And, uh, you know, I wouldn't trade my, my path for the world. I, I thought it was unbelievable. My parents were super proud and, and I was very proud of myself.
And, uh, you know, it's, uh, it, it's been a, a great life and, uh, I'm still [00:26:00] involved in the hockey world heavily to this day.
Jason Jacobs: First, I mean, thanks for sharing your story. It's so fascinating 'cause I'm also a player development nerd, although I'm much earlier in my. Journey to, in, in my education about player development. But but so yeah, really appreciate you sharing it and it's an amazing story. There's so many different directions we could go.
I, I think one question that's on my mind is that you know, there's a lot of crazy hockey parents out there and we love the game and we see that our kids love the game and we want what's best for our kids, and we assume that's what's best for our kids, is to play at the highest level that they can.
But then you look at the kid, right? And like you said, every kid is different. And and there's different drivers and different growth and different there's just so many factors that are involved and it's a long journey. So on one end extreme, you have parents that's, advice to parents that's back off, let the kid carve their own path.
And I don't [00:27:00] even think that's hockey advice. I think that's like. Life advice, like let them carve their own path. And I think, well, all right, well if I did that in other aspects of, of their lives, like they wouldn't get good grades in school and isn't it important to get good grades in school for the future?
And, and things like that. Like they need some structure, they need some guidance, they need some pushing, you know, because we need to keep the chain on the tracks. But then the other extreme, you've got people that are like, you know, hiring fancy coaches when the kids are two, and, um, trying to give them every leg up so they get a running start going to the brick because they feel like if they get on the train, then like that opens the next door and that next door opens the next door.
But if they miss the train, then like they're screwed for life. Right. Would the benefit of hindsight, like how do you reflect on your own journey and how is that informing what advice you have for parents and how you're raising your own boys?
Matt Calvert: My parents, the model of just like. Figure it out by yourself. That was in all aspects of life. It was school. I was very self-driven, so it, it worked for them, um, or worked for me, I guess I should say. It was, go to [00:28:00] hockey, work hard, have fun, figure it out, go to track and field, go to school.
It's, it's kind of all on you.
Jason Jacobs: Were, were your older brothers self-driven?
Matt Calvert: not as,
Jason Jacobs: I, I wonder if that's a younger, youngest kid thing,
Matt Calvert: yeah, it's, well, to compare my, my two boys, you know, my, my oldest is very self-driven in some things, but he, in others, he's not. My youngest is just, he's built like me. He just, he wants to be the best and everything. He does that type of thing and goes nonstop.
Jason Jacobs: brother, your, your, your brothers, your older brothers. Like, were you the self-driven one or was everyone like that?
Matt Calvert: I was the self-driven one. Both, both my older. Brothers were driven, just, uh, founded at different times. But I, right from day one, I, I was driven. But, uh, I, I look at it and, and we had this conversation the other day and I look at it's, uh, how I'm raising my kids and now all of a sudden they have a dad that was in the hockey world and, and lived this growing up.
And I battle that fine line of, you know, providing structure for them. We're in a lot more camps. We do skill [00:29:00] training, we do all this stuff. And it's not necessarily with the fanciest coaches, it's just we'll get reps on the backyard rink. You know, like I said before, like
Jason Jacobs: But, but you know, having you as a dad is the fanciest coach. I hate to break it to you.
Matt Calvert: yeah, I, I guess, and you have a, I guess you have a dad that played in the NHL, so that can possibly pass on the wisdom. So we, we do do a lot of those things and I try to ride that fine line of like. Having a schedule for them, but then letting them go do it by themselves, whether that's them going to shoot pox or them going on the rink.
And we have a lot of planned stuff, whether it's a breakfast club in the morning hockey practice for their club team you know, a skating lesson, whatever it is, our backyard rink. I really try to let them go out there and just like find the game themselves, create, you know, and do the fancy stuff every kid loves doing in Michigan now.
So those guys are working on that move. Um, just any, anything they want. And I, I think it's important for a kid, and it depends where you live. Sometimes kids don't have access to ice without coaches, but [00:30:00] I think it's important for a kid to go out there. We, we have a, we had a thing called sticks and ps at, at our rank where you go there with your buddies, it's just your skates, gloves, helmets, and sticks.
And you just go out there and make up games. You play one on one, two on two, um, maybe you're stick handling, maybe you're working on your shot, but it's the kid figuring his own stuff out. So what he learned from the lessons in those week, now he can go apply it, apply it himself and uh, and essentially figure it out.
So I try to have a balance of structure, schedule, and then free time and creativity and, and have them figure it out their selves. Because the reality is if your kid is going to be a pro hockey player, or a WHL or NCAA level guy, like they gotta want it to a girl. They gotta want it themselves. And if they don't, if they don't want it, you know, if they don't love the game or they don't love putting in the work, they're, they're not gonna enjoy themselves doing it.
And to me, the successful ones love the game. You know, I don't think I played with one guy in the NHL that. That dislikes hockey. And, and [00:31:00] that's, uh, that's my goal for my kids is for them to fall in love with the game, get the lessons it provides out of it, which is discipline, structure, teamwork, network, and ultimately just making, making friends and having a blast and creating lifelong memories.
So I battle every day with what is the best path to get there.
Jason Jacobs: Yeah, I mean, it, it's hard because, to me there's a difference between loving the game and working like Kobe Bryant, right? You can love the game and and just wanna muck around in the game. But that isn't the same thing as getting up every day and, and grinding. And then you look at. The, you know, the Instagram soundbites from the Kobe Bryants of the world about you work harder than everyone else, and it compounds over time. Right. And then you contrast that with what's age appropriate at different ages and how realistic that is. And then every parent says their kid's self-directed.
Right. But I talked to a sports psychologist, um, and [00:32:00] who's actually coming on the show, but one of the things that he said was that when he talks to the parent, I'm making up these numbers, but, but like, let's call it 80% of the parents think their kid, is doing it, is doing all the work for the love of the game.
Right? But then when the kid's talking to the same guy without the parents in the room, right? It's like flipped. It's like 20%, right? Yeah, it's just, it's hard to manage as a parent because you want your kid to have opportunities and to reach their fullest form, but you also want them to find their own path and and, and do what they love.
For me, like I didn't, also didn't have parents that pushed me, but I wasn't the most self-directed and I could have used some more structure and guidance and, and pushing, right? But it, yeah, I don't know. I like you, I, I wrestle with it every day and one of the reasons I'm doing this show is to talk to other people who have managed to navigate through, to play the game at the highest levels.
To understand yeah, just to, just to inform that decision making, especially if I'm gonna try to build a [00:33:00] platform that helps shepherd. Other kids through the process. Like, I don't wanna be part of the problem, right? I wanna, I wanna help. And, and helping doesn't necessarily mean getting there at all costs, right?
It means you know, setting you up for success in sport and in life, right? Which is not the same thing as playing at the highest level of the game that you possibly can necessarily.
Matt Calvert: You talk about, uh, putting structure in place for your kids to possibly get better because you didn't have it. I have one great example for myself and, and I talked to my, my oldest is similar to me, where. We will do a skating drill. Something that's not fun that he's not interested in. Right.
Which I completely get. You're going down, you're working on your edge work. Some kids love it. Some kids like myself, hated it. I just wanted to play a three on three game and, and have fun out there. We would go to breakfast clubs. Um, you know, we had like one breakfast club for a couple years that my parents would bring me to at seven and I wasn't much of a morning person, but the first 20 minutes was a, a figure skating coach.
She would come out and work on just basic stride work. Well, what would I [00:34:00] do? I would, you know, everything she told me, I was checked out. I would try to be the first one from goal line to goal line thinking it was a race. Never working on the technique. Did my parents say much? My dad might have said, Hey Maddie, you should, you should probably listen.
You know, once in a while, add, and I'm just like, I'm faster than everyone. Like, what, what, what are we doing out here? Like, I was just like, I was like, I don't need to work on my skating. And I was just, I was, I was young and dumb. I could, I have used a push saying, Hey. You're wasting her time out here.
Listen. Would have, I would, I have listened to that possibly. You know, my, my oldest kid, I have that battle with him all the time. I coach him and I'm like, just, just listen. You could, you know, you have a lot of potential, man. You could be so good. And, uh, so what I'm, when I was 17 years old, um, a skating coach came to Brandon and it was the first skating camp I'd ever really been in the Breakfast Club stuff.
You're just doing like minor, minor stuff. But I'd never actually gone in like a week long skating camp. So I'm like, all right, I'll, I'll go to the skating camp, you know, [00:35:00] I'm gonna the WHL next year, I, I should probably listen. I could probably learn something. So we go day one and they videotape your stride from the side, from behind and front.
You know, I'm probably cheating the drills throughout the whole hour and a half first session, and we go into the video room. And I'm in there with some kids older, some kids younger guys who I think I'm, you know, probably better hockey players than some that are better than myself. And all of a sudden I come up on the screen and he breaks down everyone's stride in, uh, in front of everyone.
And all of a sudden he goes, yeah, this is terrible technique. And you, you kick your heels, you, you don't knee bend correctly, your upper body's bent over too much, like just picks me apart. And I'm sitting there, I'm like, I'm like, I'm investigator in the room, like, what are we talking about? He goes, and he comes up to me after, and, and he could tell I was kind of like, uh, standoffish.
I'm like, what's this, this guy doesn't know what he's talking about. And he goes, he goes, man, you, you have such poor technique when you skate. He goes, you're just an extremely fast and powerful kid. And he's like, buy in. [00:36:00] And, and I'm like, all right. I'm like, I'll buy in. So I bought in all that week and it took five days for me and he completely changed my stride forever.
You know, we talk about what happened from 17 to 18. All of a sudden I go from a glorified U 18 hockey player to NHL draft pick. Well, growth was part of that. But me buying into actually listening to some technique for once and, and applying it all throughout the summer while I was getting stronger in the gym, I, my speed went from here to here in one year.
So I was a, a fast U 18 player, and now I was one of the fastest guys in the Western Hockey League. To put it into reference, I, I worked on, I worked on that stride for probably the next two to three years while getting stronger in the gym. When I went to Columbus Blue Jackets camp, we always did a speed test.
It was a pretty simple speed test. It was goal line to hash marks. They would, uh, laser time you. Um, and then I think it was goal line. To red line, to blue line back through red. Basically just, seeing how fast you were. [00:37:00] I was first in both races for seven years, so that, that would've put me up there with one of the fastest guys in the NHL.
Um, obviously if you're the fastest on the Columbus Blue Jackets. So it, me listening at 17, I wish I would've listened a little more when I was six, when I was eight, when I was 10. Um, applying this stuff while you're young, but I was athletic enough to figure it out at 17 years old and it benefited me so much so to the point of I.
Pushing your kid a little bit. Having structure for them I think is super important. I wish I would've got my butt kicked a little earlier. But like I said before, that's the balance I try is like, I want to push my kids. I give my oldest Casey an example, Hey, you're a lot like me. You know, you think you're, you think you're this good, but you could be here if you listen to these coaches and apply.
And it's something he's gotten so much better at. But I know I can't push too hard because I don't want them to lose the love for that game, uh, for the, for the game, essentially.
Jason Jacobs: Yeah, and [00:38:00] there's I definitely think there's a, he, there's a healthy and there's an unhealthy and, and it is case by case, but, but some of it, it might be hard to describe, but it's like, you know it when you see it like, like if you're trying to pull your kid to the rink. And he or, and he or she is dragging their feet and saying, I don't want to go, I hate this.
I don't wanna, I hate this. Right? Then at a certain point it's like, well, let's go find something that they love, right? But if they clearly love the game and they get up every day and they're dialed in when they're there, they's tails wagging, whatever, and then, um, and then like when they get home, like they don't always remember that like, you know, working on it gets them better and they just gravitate towards like the empty calories of the phone or the empty calories of the Xbox or whatever, right?
Like, people make it so black and white if they're out there in the back like taking their shots, then they're self-directed. And if they're not, don't even bother because they don't have it. Right? Um, and it's like, well, let's use the classroom analogy, right? That's like saying that, um, if you sit in a boring ass lecture with a monotone voice and you're falling asleep that you don't [00:39:00] love learning, right?
And it's like, well, wait a minute, if a teacher comes in and they make it engaging and conversational and interesting to learn and fun, and kids sit up in their chair and they laugh and they don't even realize that they're learning because they just make it so fun and they end up learning so much.
Like, is it because that kid loves learning and the kid in the boring lecture doesn't? No. It's because you need to package a learning in a way that's easily digestible by the kids. Right. And I feel like hockey training's the same, right? Like we expect kids to just go and shoot by their lonesome or sit on a boring exercise bike, you know, with nothing to do.
And like if you're not doing that at seven years old, like you're not gonna make it. And like, I just think that's crazy. Right? I think there's a way to. Make it more fun and engaging even when you're at home, which is one of the things I'm thinking about building. Right. And I can already hear the voices of like, like you're, you're just trying to force it and like, uh, you know, if the kids are not out there doing it anyways, then, then they don't love it.
And I think there's a lot of gray area in between and that's what I'm trying to sort through. So I don't know. What do you think about that?[00:40:00]
Matt Calvert: I, I couldn't agree more. It's, um, we talk about shooting pox. That seems to be like the work that kids can put in without anyone, without mom or dad helping them or their skill coaches. But my boys, for an example, we can go in that garage and they love, uh, we have a, a target with the, the five holes, right.
And when we go out there and they love when I'm out there, especially and we have a shooting competition, so I sit behind them. We have pucks in the middle. And, uh, and I say low blocker, high blocker, high glove, low glove five. And I give 'em different targets to hit. And if one hits it, other one doesn't, one, nothing.
And we play up to 20. We, we do that kind of thing. They could shoot 2000 pucks. Okay. Like we could play a hundred times as long as they're not, you know, getting blisters on their hands. And, uh, and they'll absolutely love it. Why? 'cause they're competing. They're, you know, it's, it's fun. It's a game. They, I think they like seeing my reaction to it.
They love having dad out there. They do so much more work. 'cause like, you know, I'm like, uh, I'm a hype guy. That's my style of [00:41:00] coaching. Like, I, that's who I was as a player in the, in the room. Um, I'm up. BII love complimenting people, so I'm always like, nasty shot to the boys. Or like, just say, just saying fun stuff.
So they like it. But if I say like, and I, and I rarely say this and my boys don't do it, you gotta go shoot 200 pucks today. Like, like they might do it, but they're not enjoying it. They're by themselves. So why do my boys, you know, how do my boys train? When do they love the hard stuff? They love it when they do it with others, right?
They love it when they got teammates there, when they make a game out of it. And, and that was the same with me. Like I, it's why I didn't do the skating lessons. It wasn't because I thought I was too good for them. It was because it wasn't fun for me. So some, and I, I try to study other coaches. I think the, the best coaches are ones that can listen and you could take something from, you know, a guy that can't even skate.
He, he might have a, a different perspective on how to coach the kids. We have one, he has NHL games. He coaches my youngest spring hockey team, and I assist with him. And I'm normally a [00:42:00] head coach and like, I have no problem being assistant coach. I don't need to be the voice all the time. And I sit there and I, I, I watch him and I, I learn from him and he coaches so much different than me.
I go out there, you know, I'm, I'm coaching. Age group up, but I'm trying to teach a little bit of structure. I do make it fun. I interact with the kids, but his style is almost no structure in practice, no board. And he puts kids in positions to have to figure it out themselves and create, and they're usually fun stuff.
So he keeps kids engaged in other ways. To me, the skill coach I talked about his name's Tyler Dimmer. He is so good at keeping kids engaged. He, he works at an academy, so these kids are on the ice five times a week working on different skills while like, it's his job not just to teach the skills, it's his job to keep these kids interested and wanting to, almost putting the power in their hands, being like, Hey, this is what we're doing today.
Now be creative within the structure and we're gonna learn the skill I'm teaching you. That being said, I, I think you're completely right. It's, it's not [00:43:00] the, the kids that go out there by themselves lonely that shoot 500 pox. It's the, it's the, it's how can you, as a parent, how can you make it a game for them?
You know? You don't always have to be there. We don't have the time. But yeah,
Jason Jacobs: Okay lemme try to ask this question. Properly. What is the dif where is the line drawn in terms of helping make it fun to take something that they didn't want to do and make it more engaging for them to maximize their development versus living vicariously and trying to fulfill your own dreams and projecting that on your kids.
Like how do you know when you get, when you delve into unhealthy territory and where is that line?
Matt Calvert: That's a, that's a great question. I don't, I don't know where that line is. I, I wrote down before like parent and expectations on my notes and. It's like, I think you gotta ask yourself what you want outta the sport for your kid. And you need gentle reminders along the way, whether that's self reminders or speaking with other parents.
'cause [00:44:00] a lot of parents like confide in me and talk, should we be doing this? You know, should we go to this tournament this summer? Should he be doing skating lessons, skill work, like all this kind of stuff. And, and my number one thing is, is read your kid. You know, there's, there's some kids out there that can do that.
All that stuff that enjoy doing all that stuff. My oldest, for example, doesn't enjoy doing it all. Like, he, he loves the game. He loves gonna these tournaments, sometimes he, he may not love the skating or the skill work or whatever, but there's a line for him. They're like, I know when he's. He's done.
My youngest, he can do more. He could probably do it every day throughout the winter, in the spring season and, and still enjoy it. But he has times where like, oh, I wanna go to baseball. I wanna play on the block with my kid or with my buddies. You know, I wanna go play basketball in the backyard, whatever it may be.
I think reading your kid is super important because, like I talked about my path, I wasn't that kid that shot 200 pucks a day. I, I was the kid that wanted to go play every [00:45:00] other sport and in turn I was developing for hockey, right? There's kids that just, you know, I grew up with one. He was a first round NHL draft pick.
Um, his name's Alex Pons and he, he ended up playing a couple games in the HL, but. He wanted to, he had a pro hockey player dad as well, but he wanted to go, they had this thing called the training center where he'd go shoot pox and work out. And, and I don't know if it was self-driven or pushed by his dad, or a mixture of both, but he always wanted to go do hockey stuff when I was like, man, I'm going to play backyard baseball.
I'm going to do this. And it was just two different personalities and he seemed to love it. He went to a hundred skating camps. He wasn't the strongest skater. That was probably his weakness. But he loved going to these skating camps and, and trying to get better. And my biggest thing is, is read your own kid.
Make sure, you know, there is a work component to it, but make sure it is also, they're also having a ton of fun doing it. And, and find that balance, you know, it's, it's gotta be in moderation at times. Because at the end of the day. The best [00:46:00] hockey players are the ones that compete and have fun.
And, and if they don't, if they don't have a hundred percent in their tanks where they want to be there and they're really enjoying it, you're not gonna get the best effort outta the kid. And then in turn, as a parent, you might be mad at that kid which you shouldn't be. So to me it's keep the hunger levels high and uh, and the enjoyment level high, and you're gonna see the, the best version of your, of your child.
Jason Jacobs: It's 10 o'clock, by the way. Are you okay on time?
Matt Calvert: Yep. I'm good.
Jason Jacobs: Okay. So related to that I, I want to pick up on something you just said and you said it casually, you probably didn't even think about it, but you said that your older boy has a, has a line right. And sometimes doesn't feel like doing this stuff.
Like, that's just a matter of fact thing to say and everyone knows that's, true with all of our kids about some things. I feel like people are afraid to admit that about their kid in hockey, right? Everyone feels like they need to project like. My kid only has one speed and it's go, like, there's no amount, it's too much.
[00:47:00] Load 'em up, load 'em up, load 'em up. And then I feel like they think that's what the coaches wanna hear. And then the coaches are feeling heat from the clubs because the teams, 'cause 'cause the, the clubs want the coaches to build winning teams because the winning teams build the brand of the club and then if you build the brand of the club, right?
So like it's all a business, right? And and so, I find right that as a dad, and, and granted, you know, my kid, I only have one kid in the game and he's my oldest, so I don't have a, I'm figuring out in the dark for what comes next. But, but I find that you need to actively manage for what's best for your kid and not just go with the wind.
Because if you go with the wind, the economy of hockey will make it so that you're always going all the time and you're gonna burn out your kid and, prevent him or her from being a happy, healthy, well-rounded kid that's setting the table for a successful life. Right. Yeah. How do, how do you, do you feel the same and, and how do you.
How do you manage that tension? Especially because it, you know, back to, you know, there's, there's these books that like the ones that get in early, get the opportunity and then that opportunity leads to the next level of [00:48:00] opportunity and that, right. So it's like that mindset, right? Is that a reality or is that just an unhealthy mindset that you should block out and ignore?
Matt Calvert: I think it's unhealthy and I think what a lot of parents would, it would help for them to hear and like they don't, they don't have the experiences. I do, I guess, and I'll use some of the best players in the world as an example. Uh, Nathan McKinnon. I played him three years and he, this is a, a guy that's quite a bit younger than me and, uh, extremely self-driven.
But he would push me whether it was nutrition, how I work out, how hard I'm practicing, and I was supposed to be one of the veterans on the team and I just got to Colorado. And it, it's amazing how much I learned from him about, you know, doing the right things to be at your best at all times, practice the best you'll be, you'll, you'll be the best on the ice or the best version of yourself, that type of thing.
But as far as putting in extra work, there's not anyone out there that does more than Nathan McKinnon. Um, this, he is so driven to be one of the best players in the world and win. And it's not about, and for [00:49:00] him, it's not about everyone. Look at me. I'm, you know, I'm, I'm in the heart trophy conversation. I, I can win the Art Ross every year.
It's like. Winning is all that matters to him, and, and I appreciate that so much from him. Then you have Kale, mcar. So we actually billed Kale the first four or five weeks of his career. He lived with my family. Um, he came in from UMass played a series against, uh, Calgary first round, and then we had San Jose second round.
We ended up beating Calgary and uh, kale lived with us and I always found it funny because. Nate would be on Kale for, staying out a half hour after practice or going out a half hour early. And, and Kale didn't do this stuff. Kale is just naturally gifted. Does Kale put in the work? Absolutely.
Like he takes care of his body. I'm not saying that. But compared to McKinnon, I, I'm not even sure he'd put in, a quarter of the work. Right. And it's just, it's two different stories. And then, and then you have one other, and this is a full other extreme. It's one of my best friends, Ryan Johanson.
He's outta the league now. You know, he just had hip surgery and he played in Columbus with [00:50:00] me and, and Asheville and in Colorado, and traded to Philly was the end of his career. But Joey, as we call him, never put a second in the gym. And you know, when I say that, he, of course he worked out, but compared to most hockey players, he relied on natural talent.
Very light conditioning, very little extra work. He loves golfing, he loves doing other things. This is a guy that's, I don't know what his frame is, 6 3, 200 plus, and was, and was gifted just great hands. He's a number one center in the NHL for a long time. So you have three different versions of very successful hockey players where they all put in different types of work to, to get to where they need to be.
All are very gifted players in their own way, whether it's, kale skating or I guess Nathan McKinnon skating or johansson's, uh, playmaking abilities or, hands all have different, uh, different strengths, but all have different lines as well and different things that [00:51:00] work for them, for Nathan McKinnon, for him to feel right.
It's, it's doing everything possible and checking every box for kale, MC car, it might be. Doing, doing a decent amount of work, feeling loose, feeling great mentally. For, for Ryan Johanson it might mean not putting in a lot of work at all and just, and, feeling good in the rest of his life to be successful in the ice.
So when I say read your kid, you know, I have two different kids myself. And it's, uh, both have different needs and wants and, uh, for them to, and then they're both very good hockey players, you know, in their own right. But, uh, but both have different paths to have that success.
Jason Jacobs: Okay so counter that with the, you know, one thing you hear a lot as a, as a hockey parent is you hear. in, in all youth sports for that matter. It's like, trust a coach, leave it to the coach, get out of the way, just be a cheerleader and don't do anything else. But but contrast, coaches, even the, even the best coaches that, that care about each [00:52:00] kid's development path, they don't have the cycles to focus on each kid's development path, right?
Um, so if you actually want to do what's right for your kid and manage not just their hockey path, but their life path, right? I feel like you need to play a more active role. And that sits a little funny with me because growing up, none of the parents play that active role that it seems like you need to do to be the best parent today, right?
And so, yeah, what do you think about that? Like, is that really true? And if that's true, then why wasn't it true when we were growing up?
Matt Calvert: I, I wouldn't, uh, I wouldn't say to just listen to the coach. Coach is one opinion, whether he has amazing coaching experience, former player, or just played, minor hockey growing up. Like you can learn different things from different coaches, but at the end of the day. Views are subjective and like, and like a coach might like your kid, A coach might be telling him the right stuff.
He, he might, be telling him the [00:53:00] wrong stuff, whatever it is. You talk, we talk about having a skill coach, a skating coach, and not specifically, but hearing different voices I think is very important. And for a, a parent that, you know, like mine that didn't know anything about the hockey world, what do they do?
They would defer to the local guy that played a couple pro games in the central hockey league, right? Like, that's what we had to, that's who my parents had to ask questions. You know, what's the perfect path? What's the right idea? They never, always had the right answers, I think. I think as a parent, if you want the best for your kid talk to a lot of people.
Listen, listen to podcasts listen to there, there's so, there's so much available out there. Where you can hear a general manager talk on a podcast, you can go on, I don't know if you know what 32 thoughts is. Elliot Friedman, you can listen to the day-today in the NHL. You, there's, there's coaching podcasts out there, and to me it's just listening to different perspectives.
I listened to one I believe Granado was on, I don't know if it's the coach's site or whatever the podcast was. I, I can't recall it at this moment, but just hearing[00:54:00]
Jason Jacobs: have a bunch of good stuff. Fact that coaches site.
Matt Calvert: and, and it's,
Jason Jacobs: they had, I think, I think their event is this week actually, which I, gosh, I would've loved to go to, but I just couldn't, couldn't make it work.
Matt Calvert: Yeah. And, uh, and, and I listen to a decent amount of it, but even if it's a soccer coach or a football coach, and I, I'm a huge football fan. I love football. I love, it's so different than hockey. And, uh, I love listening to coach speak from football. You know, Kelly, MCC Crimin, who was my coach and junior, he would often often reference football coaches and, and how football teams work and relate it to hockey.
Hello. I had John Tortorella in the NHL coaching me, and sometimes he was calling the one end of the ice and end zone. And I'm like, this isn't, this isn't football, John. And, uh, but that's okay. It's, it was the point that he was trying to get across. And uh, it's just like you can learn from so many people.
One coach doesn't have all the right answers, which I know there's a lot out there that preached that. This is the way, this is the path. I got little Johnny to the, you know, NCAA because this is [00:55:00] what he did, but. It's to each their own and, and get a lot of opinions and, and do your research. If you're that motivator of a parent, like this is the stuff you can listen to, hearing other people's experiences, what works for some, doesn't work for others type of thing.
Jason Jacobs: So from a development standpoint, given that everyone's path is so different but at the same time, teams wanna build comradery, consistent quality, have, have common expectations, across the team. How do you balance that consistency and equal expectations across the team with tailoring the development path to what works best for each kid.
And I, I don't even know I don't know if I'm asking that from a coach standpoint or a. Or a parent's standpoint or, or a kid's standpoint, but just like I, I guess I'm asking that just from overall, like what's best.
Matt Calvert: I will try to break it down. Uh. An example I coach, uh, I coach spring hockey and I coach the 2016 bours. [00:56:00] It's called the Man Toba Junior Ice. So I talk about this brick hockey tournament and they call it like the pre-B brick year. Everything's based on this one, one tournament, which sounds like an awesome, awesome time.
And it's essentially supposed to be some of the top 10 year olds in North America at the tournament, or the ones who can afford it because it, it's a very expensive path depending on where you live. When they come to me. My biggest goal, and without going too deep here, U nine Hockey and Manitoba. So a U nine major tried out for my 2016 Manto Junior Ice team.
We play half four on four hockey, so we don't play the full five on five. We do it for developmental reasons. I won't, I won't go down that path. But when we come to spring, we play full ice, five on five real hockey. We went to a tournament in Toronto and uh, awesome tournament. There's, I think Boston Junior Bruins are there.
You got Team Detroit, you got bc you got a bunch of Ontario teams. We played Chea, like it was, it was pretty cool. But what did I see there? [00:57:00] We were the only team that played this four on four halfway structure and for skill development, it's small area stuff. I, I think it's like, I think it benefited us a lot.
Like we weren't less talented, but we were less structured. Okay, so when you're, my goal when I coach that Manitoba Junior Ice team is to teach these kids structure because they're getting a ton of skating work with other coaches, skill development work. They do it all throughout the winter, some throughout the spring.
But when they come to me, it's team concepts. It's learning how to play as a team. It's learning how to, how to be a winger. 'cause all year long they're playing four on four hockey where you're just all over the ice. It's learning how to be a defenseman, skate backwards. Now that you've got full ice, you know what to do in zone, how to play five on five.
So my message for them isn't about developing their individual skills, it's about teaching them team concepts so we can compete with these other teams. 'cause even if we are more talented, if you're not playing as a team at this level, when they are, [00:58:00] they can beat you down and, and be a lesser team.
So that's one coach's message to them. How to be a good teammate, how to play within a team concept would be the two main things we've worked on. Now, my expectation for them when they're not with me, and we're not together a whole lot because we live all over the province, we had about 13 practices spread over three to four months is now they go to their skill coaches and not necessarily they have their own skill coaches, but whatever it is, camps, whatever they, their parents have set up for them and now they're learning the individual skills so they can apply those skills within the team concept and learn the game with me.
So there's your, there's your two avenues right there. So the message you're getting from me is, hey. Positioning, where to go, how do we create more offense as a group? And then they're going to work on their individual skills. So now when they do go across the middle and they're calling for the pass, they're able to pick that P up.
Now when they're, they're in a one-on-one situation in the corner, they have that in and out move and that release off their shot where they can score a goal within the team [00:59:00] concept. So that's why listening to one coach and like, and I, I know a coach and I certainly won't drop names, you know, he runs skills as well, and he coaches the team.
Well, he, like, he pressures them in, the players into saying, you have to train your skills with us or else you won't be able to do what you can within the team. And, and that's toxic. And I know there's, there's a lot out there like that. You know, you can't go to this other guy and it, it becomes, the reality is, is people make a lot of money off youth hockey or minor hockey.
And it's, uh, in some spots it's, you know, it's great. Some spots it's not. And, uh, so a lot of times you're getting mixed messages on what's the, what's the best route for John Muir Sally. So you have to be careful. You take in what you can from certain coaches and you, but you also, broaden your view and, and, do your research, listen to podcasts, do whatever, whatever it takes.
Listen to NHL GM speak you know, on what's the best, uh, and, and go from there.
Jason Jacobs: You were excited about this digital [01:00:00] platform that I'm thinking about and. You as a dad, you're well equipped, obviously, to provide your kids guidance. And then as a coach, same thing. And then it sounds like your kids are getting great attention on the skills front, whether it be individually or groups or whatever, but there's good coverage.
If you will. Why were you excited about this platform? Was it for you or was it for others that maybe don't have access to all the stuff that that, that your kids do? Because where, where are the gaps? Because in talking to you, it's not obvious that there are any.
Matt Calvert: I'm excited about it because the more I get in the minor hockey, spring hockey world, whatever you want to call it I, I, I don't want to use the term crazy parents, 'cause everyone, everyone loves their kids. They want the best for their kids. And I, I love that. If you're putting everything into your kid and, you know, sometimes too much but it's like they, they want the best for their kids at the end of the day, for the most part.
And. The more, when you talk to someone that's been through it [01:01:00] like I told you the other day, like we are so fortunate our U 11 minor hockey programs have, you know, the coaches we have the PRO or NHL experience even is, is crazy. Like our, our U 11 coaches, we have four A one teams. There's myself, there's a, a guy that was a second round draft pick the HL played probably 500 pro games.
His brother helps him. He has 500 pro games as well. We have another guy that played in the Western League his whole career and some pro games. We have another NHL coaching U nine with 300 NHL games plus. We have a lot of like another guy coaching Unite as well with another 600 pro games like we are, and we're in a city of 50,000.
So we are, we are very lucky to have what we have, but the, the biggest thing is, is. The one thing I run into is parents thinking. They, they know like the path, they know what's right for their kid and, and they're trying hard. [01:02:00] And I see a lot of parents that almost disagree with people that have been through it.
And there's gonna be times where, your kid goes on a spring team and he might not get that shift in overtime. He might not, you know, he might not be playing as much as the other kids. And it's emotional for parents, it's emotional for the kid. My main message to the these kids and what every parent can help and not on the ice, is their mindset.
And to me, like after playing in the NHL and playing with so many successful players, every single one of them has the right mindset. And, you know, are they the most talented in the world? Not always, like you go to the a HL and, and I always use this as my best example, when you get to the A HL, which is one step below the NHL.
You're right there. Okay. You've worked your whole life to the NHL. And guess what? You have the best kid from Czechia, from Sweden. You have the best kids from the CHL, the ncaa. Everyone's been a dog wherever they've [01:03:00] been. Now, how do you separate yourself once you're with all these dogs? Okay. And, and it's, it's mindset.
HLS hard because you're playing in a, let's say you're 20, 21, 22, 23 years old, whatever it is. Say you're a young guy in your first three years, your entry level deal, and you want to get that call up. Well, there's eight guys in your team that probably deserve that call up. There's some guys that are there that'll only play in the hhl.
But how do you separate yourself? And it's, uh, I talk with my clients through my agency a lot about this. It's being able to ride that roller coaster. It's like, okay, did you have a great game? Did you know your teammate? Was he better than you the last two weeks? Not being too high on your high, not being too low on your lows.
It's an old saying, but it's, it's such a real thing. Like there is gonna be adversity every step of the way. And the one thing I say to my clients when we first meet is get comfortable talking about your weaknesses and be ready to ride a roller coaster if you want to play junior in pro hockey, because it is ups and downs, [01:04:00] it's wins and losses.
It's it's fourth line to first line, third d pairing to scratch, to first d pairing. It is, it's a crazy ride. You know, one day, like, like I said, you could be a, a glorified U 18 all star the next day you're drafted to the NHL. That's how quick things can change. And with my boys. It's not about the skill training necessarily or the skating lessons.
Like my oldest doesn't skate technically well, like he's a pretty sloppy skater. My youngest, pretty natural skater. Good on his edges, he kicks his heels up. He does a lot of wrong things, but I'm not super worried about changing those things right now or just being like, you have to skate perfect. I'm, this is what I train on them every day.
I train their mindset. How do you deal with that adversity? Where, hey, my, my 7-year-old, he plays a year up and he was playing kids two years up all spring and, and it's a grind for him and I absolutely love it. He can go play his own agent score eight to 10 a game. That's, that's how talented he can be.
But I love that [01:05:00] he's grinding. We played in the finals, we lost in the finals a few weeks ago in Saskatoon, and he wasn't that great in the final game. And, and he came out after and I go, how'd you think he played? And uh, and he goes, he goes. You know, he's seven years old, but he is like, not that great. And I'm like, honestly, like, you know, I thought you were decent.
You, you looked tired. You know, by the end, we had a fun weekend. We did the trampoline park, he went to lacrosse game. Like it wasn't just hockey, but I'm like, you gotta like, I'm like, it's such a good learning curve for you to find right at the end of the game. They had a two on one. He didn't pass the wide open guy, and they're just learning how to pass.
He's seven years old and they're 8-year-old teammates and he's, they're just learning how to move the puck. And I'm like, that's such a good learning curve for you to lose in a championship game one, and realize that, hey, you had a chance to help tie that game. You make that play over to that guy. But I'm like, guess what buddy?
I'm like, you're gonna be put in these situations all the way up. And it's a mindset, were you tired? Yes, you're tired. How do we, how can we be effective [01:06:00] when we're tired? And he is seven years old. And, and he's sitting there and he's like, and he's having conversations with me. And what I really try to do with my kids is not tell them, you were terrible.
You didn't work hard. You were tired. It's, it's like, it's like, be real with yourself. Yeah. I was gassed. We had a fun weekend, but how do we find a way to be effective? Whether that's in hockey or school or, or, uh, baseball when we're tired, when we're not our best. And I had a, um, Dan High knows his name.
He was a assistant coach in Columbus for us. He actually just, uh, gone on with Tampa, um, as assistant coach again, and he came up to me my first year in the NHL and I'm on the table getting my growing work done. I'm just like, I'm like pissed because I'm, I'm not gonna be a hundred percent and I'm young and I'm grinding.
And he goes, he goes, Maddy, the way you play, he goes, if you feel 70% every night, he goes, that's gonna be your new a hundred percent. You know, you're, you're a shot blocker. You go hard. You hit, you fight, you do all the things. He's like, he's like, you gotta, you gotta get used to finding ways. To do it when you're not at your [01:07:00] best.
And, and I'm, I'm kind of going off on a tangent here, but I talk about mindset training, and that's for my kids. It's like adversity, like welcome adversity. Don't say, Hey, this coach doesn't like you. This coach isn't, you know, didn't play you in overtime. Well, my question to 'em is, well, how do we, how do we get there?
And yes, there are some toxic coaches that dislike kids and don't treat them fairly. And, and sometimes the grass is greener. But what I talk about with my kids and my clients is, is like, welcome the adversities. Because essentially like those are, those are what are making you better. And, and then I, I try to teach them how to give them a skill set, how to deal with those adversities.
Because you're presented with new ones every single day in hockey in life. And, and we go back to, uh, you know, I, I wrote parents and expectations and I had discipline, structure, teamwork, confidence dealing with adversity will like. These are the things you're learning from the sport of hockey, from the sport of football from going to school.
You [01:08:00] name it. The day-to-day, day-to-day lessons. And that's, that's the reminder I want to give. And it kind of brings me back full circle that why you wanna be involved with this platform, why I had interest in this. It's to get more people that maybe have been through it to get that message out to more parents.
That, hey, just because Johnny had one bad tournament or this coach didn't play him, is not the end of the road for this kid. It's, it's something that he's gonna take a massive life lesson out of. And whether it was fair or unfair that's gonna make him better. And it's gonna, it's gonna prepare him for whatever real life brings them, them later on.
Jason Jacobs: I have a few minutes, but I but now I'm the one running outta time. But, um, but one thing I I'd like to touch on is you know, now you're working as an agent and and it seems like increasingly including at your agency, agents are beefing up their player development capabilities. It'd be great to understand what that means.
It'd be, [01:09:00] and then it'd be great to understand is what you're envisioning almost. I, I, here's what I picture, I picture like the agent as like shaking hands and kissing babies and like making the calls that can be more objective because they're not dad calling. Right. And then and then player development is more around mindset development, doing the right stuff, staying focused, not getting discouraged, like doing the things that will actually make you.
The shaking hands of kissing babies more effective because it gives it more to work with. Right. And so, um, one, do I have that understanding right, and two, it's what you're envisioning almost packaging that value prop on the player development side and opening up for everyone else that doesn't have an agent and that it wouldn't make sense to get an agent for at least yet.
Matt Calvert: And there are, uh. There are a couple different options. There's agents, then they're advisors. If you go to ncaa, they're technically an advisor. Because you can't really have an agent and every different company or person provides a different skillset. So our idea being a small agent is very hard.
You go to [01:10:00] recruit some of the top guys and you have the Wasserman's, the Newport, the CAA guys. They, they represent, you know, octagon. They represent Mako Ranson and Leon Dry. You know, some got Crosby, McKen, like, try to compete with that when you're client list isn't, isn't big. So, like my partner Joe Ger, he is a, he, he's a lawyer by day and uh, sports agent by night, I say.
And, and he is the guy that deals with the contracts that you know, I don't wanna say kiss the babies, but talks, talks to the parents. I do as well. But I think what makes us good is he is so dialed in on. The C, BA, the contracts, the details, and, and it's, it's funny because I've seen a lot of agents, I've seen a lot of like high profile agents that aren't even close to his dial then is what he is.
He like, he cares about the player. And I'm not saying these other agents don't like, there's a lot of great ones out there. It's just our idea was to stay small and be [01:11:00] selective so we can focus on our players. If we grow, we want, we want to grow. With those players. We want to add, we wanna add good people type of thing.
My role is on the developmental side and that's, that's kind of how we thought we would separate ourselves when we're competing with these, with these big dog agents. 'cause they, they have such a great track record and I understand why families want to go with them. So that's where I enter in and I, as soon as we get a client I start talking about developments and, and that could be anything that could be watching their shifts.
I talked about mindset. That's my number one goal with these kids. Like the successful ones, they have so many coaches. They got their skill coach, they, some have nutritionists, some like you, you name it. Parents are doing it. What can I be, I could be that guy to bounce ideas off, Hey, hey coach, I just got, you know, I got put on the fourth line today.
I'm a goalie. I'm not starting games. Like, how do you deal with this? Okay. Well, a lot of times what agents do is, and I, I use this example, John Tortorella, he [01:12:00] came in one day. And he goes, I, I, I'll try not to swear on here, but he, every second word is a swear of his mouth. But if one more bleeping agent, Coles Ymo, who was our GM in Columbus about their ice time, when I'm sitting 10 feet down in my coach's office and you can't come talk to me like a man, like, we're 20 to 30, 40-year-old men when you can't come to talk to me like a man, and my style is never call my agent.
You know, like I, I wa I stormed in that coach's office, maybe should have taken 24 hours before I did it, but, uh, but like, I would go and I'm like, man, you got issues lame on the table. Let, let's figure this out. Why am I not playing? What do I need to do more? These are the questions you need to ask your coach in, in the, in a respectful way.
If I do more, will I get that opportunity? And so my clients call me and my, uh, my first thing to them is, is not me calling the GM and saying, Hey. Jason needs power play ice time. Like what are we doing here? He's a second round pick. Like you guys are hurting him. [01:13:00] It's like go have a conversation with your coach.
Okay? And that's not being lazy on an agent's side of things. It's like, go see what you need to do. Alright, I'll watch a video on it. Now how can we apply that? How can we give you more opportunity to get what you want? That being said, if they're still not getting what they want, then the agent hat comes on and you maybe have that conversation with the gm.
Okay, he's doing everything you asked. Is there just not opportunity there? Now maybe you look for greener grass. Okay? Are you looking for a trade? Is that possible? And the NCAA with how crazy the transfer portal is now kids are going from one school to another school to another school. And, sometimes that's good, but I think with all this opportunity now, it's, it's giving guys excuses to not work on themselves.
So that's kind of the message I, I try to give to my clients. And I think we've got such a great balance of Joe on the contractual side of things, the details, the, I call 'em the brains, and then me just getting to talk hockey and, and getting these guys through [01:14:00] that rollercoaster ride. And you do see other agencies adding development coaches?
When we first started this thing, I had one agent, uh, offered me to join them and become their development coach. Because they're realizing that, you know, people are doing this. There's advisors out there that are watching player shifts. I'm not sure they know much about hockey, but they're charging families.
One, they're gonna make those calls, they're gonna try to open those doors. And families are paying to have an advisor, and then two, they're watching their shifts and sending them clips off the Insta software or whatever it is they use which I think can be helpful. But, you know, I use this, uh, this example the other day with you.
I am, I'm a golf nerd. I want to become the best golfer I can become well without the proper direction and learning the why of the golf swing. Just to give you an example, my swing's a mix of probably Bubba Watson and Alex Ovechkin slapshot. And it's, and it was real bad before, and, and I, I finally took my first five [01:15:00] golf lessons of my life basically this year.
And I said, you know what, kinda like my skating lessons. I'm gonna, I'm gonna listen. I'm not gonna say anything. I'm just gonna listen and soak it all in and try to apply this and then work on it in my own time. Now I can go to the driving range, and I have the direction because my golf coach taught me how to swing the club, how I'm supposed to swing the club.
At least now I've mixed it with how I normally swing. I've found some success, but when I go to that range, I know the why I, I've been showed the right way. Now I can watch these Instagram videos that everyone watches become a better golfer or hockey player. There's so much out there on social media that can help you, but I've had someone show me a direction and show me the why.
And I guess that's essentially what a development coach or a skill coach or any type of coach can provide your kid. You know, instead of going and shooting a thousand pucks, but maybe doing it wrong a thousand times maybe he's been taught the right way. Now he can exponentially get better instead of just slowly get better.
Right. And I'm going off [01:16:00] like crazy right now, but that's essentially what we provide with our agency is two sides of the coin. And I think you're gonna see a lot more agencies provide that for players because their model is get all the top kids, you know, the big agencies, I should say, get all the top kids.
If they can get a lot of kids. And you know, at the end of the day, X amounts are gonna be successful NHLs and, and go from there. Our model is kind of be selective, stay in a smaller group and really try to get these guys to their highest poten potential and, and get 'em to their, the best level they can get to.
Jason Jacobs: Uhhuh. Well, I'm dying to talk to you more about the digital platform. I if, if we don't wrap, I I think my wife's gonna kill me because I've got an appointment that I really can't be late for, but, um, but, but, to, to wrap maybe just speak to, for any families out there of players that might be a fit for the advisory work that you're doing.
You know, what profile's, the right profile and how should [01:17:00] people find you, if that might be a fit. And then, and then also just parting words for, parents of the, of, of the little guys and girls, uh, that are coming up as well. Um, just words of wisdom, key takeaways that, that you wanna leave them with.
Matt Calvert: Yeah, so we, we have two options. We have Cal Sports Management you can find us on our websites. Our, our goal with Cal Sports is to represent pro hockey players or who we think have the chance. And like, if I was scouting myself at 14 to 16, like I would not have been a client with Cal Sports.
Like I just, it, someone would've watched me and said, yeah, this guy will never play pro hockey 'cause my size and, and whatever. And that, and that's completely fine. It's, it's funny 'cause we have so many family, we had so many families emailing us, can you represent my kid? And, and we don't charge the family anything because our model is if they make, they have a pro contract someday, that's how you make money and you're representing these kids from 14 on.
So you could essentially have a kid for six to eight years and he might never play pro hockey and, [01:18:00] which is fine, but. Joe, like I said, is a working lawyer myself. I do this because I like, I want to help out and, and I want to build a successful business, but what we brought in was Ora Hockey advisors and without going too deep and, making your wife too mad at you there were a lot of rule changes and, uh, in junior hockey and now a CHL player guy that plays in Canada can now go to NCAA after the CHL before it was one way or the other.
You pick your path, that's your way to pro hockey or that's your, that's your junior career, college career. Now there are so many questions and there are not a lot of answers. Even, um, NHL GM or a NCAA coach or a recruiter or a CHL GM or coach, they don't have those answers. Everyone's trying to figure it out.
And the parents have a thousand questions, right, of what's the best path for John Deer Sally, and how do we get 'em there? So that's why we brought in Aura Hockey Advisors and, and that's essentially what we'll do. So. You talk about the small guy, [01:19:00] the, the Matt Culverts of the world, like I probably would've been with Ora Hockey and it would've been, you know, can you make phone calls for me?
Can you teach me the, the right things to do, or give me advice on that at least. And essentially that's what that, that company provides. And we're just launching that right now. And it's, it's almost officially there. I think we have three or four clients already, and it's, it's something we will build, but there's a need in both sides.
There's a need for the elite player at that level. Doesn't mean they're gonna be the elite ones. And then there's a, there's a need for the, the kids still trying to figure it out. And someone, like you said before, instead of mom and dad calling and, talking about how good Johnny is, your advisor gets to do it.
Right. Is other than that though, the, the message for the, the small, the small boy or girl out there, it's, it's like I'm a, I'm a living example of it and I hate to always use myself, but I, there's so many NH Ls I played with that weren't the top guy. Growing up and I want, and it's because you didn't have an amazing brick tournament at 10.[01:20:00]
It's funny, I, what I do now is I go on elite prospects and you can, uh, the website, it's a great, it's a great tool 'cause they have all the information for a 14-year-old kid even. But I'll look at these kids that were drafted in the first round of WHL or NHL draft picks, and I always go back and they have their, and I, I keep using this one hockey term as example because people put her on a pedestal and apparently it's an unbelievable time and I've, I haven't been, and hopefully next year with my own kid, but I look at their brick stats and I'm like, how is this guy at 10 just because I'm in this world?
I'm like, I'm like, how is this 15th overall NHL projected draft pick at 10 years old? What were, what was the stat line at the. The tournament that everyone thinks is the NHL and, and they might have one assist or in six games, or they didn't, uh, they didn't even play in it because maybe mom and dad didn't have the money, which is completely fine.
But I guess that's my message is there are so many, so much opportunities, so many great tournaments out there, so many high level teams. I had a [01:21:00] client the other day, we had our agency camp. He is, he was CCHA rookie of the year in college at Michigan Tech. Um, he went to Columbus Blue Jackets development camp.
He's a hopeful pro hockey player. And I said to him, we had 25 guys here. I told you we play on the man Toba Junior ace. Well there's a team below that. There's a team below that, just in one province. I said. Gordo was his, his nickname. I go, didn't you play on the third tier team in spring growing up?
And he goes, yeah. And I'm like, look at you now, man. I'm like, you know, did it matter? And this is a driven kid. This is a kid that just got better every single year, was a late developer and he played on the third tier team in Manitoba growing up. And it's, that's just one small example. And now, maybe someday signs a, a pro contract, I dunno if that's NHL or Europe or a HL or whatever it may be.
But it's like, it's not a race, it's the development is not a race. Kids are always at mentally at a different level, physically at a different level. Then, you know, some might find a coach that believes in them and [01:22:00] inspires them what, whatever it is. Or just decide they wanna be a hockey player finally, you know, maybe they're just a kid until they're 13, 14 years old.
So that, that would be my message to everyone is don't. Like anything in life, don't judge it by the day. Judge it by the amount of work you put in. And, and you know, you'll, you'll know if your kid wants to do it, because like I said before, if you don't love it, it's not for you. It, it's not for the kid.
And if it's the parent loving it more than the kid, you often see it when the times get tough, when you get to the big games and you get to the big moments. And and there's just so, so many valuable lessons that you can learn from hockey or sports or, or anything in life. And, and remind yourself because we do get caught up in the competitiveness of it.
Remind yourself, and I have to do this often too. I'm not, not even close to perfect with it, that that's why you're there. That they're, wow, they're learning life lessons that are gonna help them deal with whatever they decide they want to do when they grow up.
Jason Jacobs: Amazing, [01:23:00] Matt. Well, gosh, I enjoyed this discussion. I learned so much. I have no doubt that listener as will as well best of luck. I, I guess it's the, not, not so new journey anymore, but with the, you know, with the journey as an agent and as a, as a dad and hockey dad. And I'll definitely keep you posted as my stuff gets further along as well, because yeah, there, there could be some areas for sure to collaborate with you and, and, uh, and others like you who, who wanna stay in the game and are looking for the, the right vessel to do so.
And, and love helping the, you know, the next generation coming up.
Matt Calvert: Awesome, Jason. Thanks for having me.